Way to settle the Zeta Riticuli debate forever?

[Irishseekers]

Originally Posted by marduk

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wow!_signal

thanks for that

[Brian Now]

Originally Posted by marduk

For example, a civilization somewhere in the so-called "Galactic Habitable Zone" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Habitab...habitable_zone) could be as far as 50K light years from earth, meaning that it would take 50,000 years for the signal to reach us. It would expand out in a sphere from the civilization's center and reach us when that sphere was 50,000 light years wide.

You mean the sphere is 100,000 ly wide don't you?
Seems that if the distance from there to here is 50,000 ly then that would only be the radius of the sphere.

Hehehe, I don't mean to be picky, but I have to do something with all this caffeine energy don't I!

[marduk]

Originally Posted by Brian Now

You mean the sphere is 100,000 ly wide don't you?
Seems that if the distance from there to here is 50,000 ly then that would only be the radius of the sphere.

Hehehe, I don't mean to be picky, but I have to do something with all this caffeine energy don't I!

Yep, math was a bit off there. But you get my gist.

[Hoffmeister]

Well I have a conclusion to the whole thing now anyway. Apparently we can only detect planets around 1.5 times the size of earth minimum, but as mentioned, when the Kepler satelite is launched next year we will be able to see planets light years away and see whether they have life on them.
I decided to ask Seth Shostak his views on whether looking at the Zeta region would kill of the Betty and Barney hill story,today and his reply was:

"Well, I don't know if the Reticuli system has actually been observed. No planets there have been found, I believe. I should look up the list of detected planets ... But really, it doesn't matter, because Friedman could always (and in this case correctly) argue that our planet detection systems are not yet able to find Earth-size planets around such stars. Not sensitive enough. So a non-detection wouldn't kill his story.

But ... the technology is getting better, and Kepler launches next year!"

So in 1 year, or maybe two years max, we will not only know whether that story is true, but I have a hunch we will have found life on other planets via this telescope anyway....
Right, i have to go bowling with work now, but i'll catch you guys later lol

[marduk]

Of course, if there aren't earth-like planets there, or life on them, that doesn't mean that there isn't some kind of base there.
We'll probably never end the debate until we go there. Maybe not even then

[Irishseekers]

People who have interest in this subject" Believe it to be that' there is number of civilisation's out there that are visiting us ' (Am i "Right or am i Wrong )To me they dont seem to what to get in touch with the mainstream public" So why do we think we are ever going to pick up a signal from there Home planet "When they act in such a way to avoid us as much as they can. Am i right in suggestion if they are from other dimensions' That it would be virtually impossible to pick up a signal " I am open to be wrong in that conclusion

[Hoffmeister]

i'm afraid there is no 'wrong' or 'right' in anyones conclusions. There is only compelling cases, and human testimony which is not only highly unreliable in many cases as our memories of situations can change over time and also there are people who make claims because they want to 'be somebody' or do it for the book revenues.

There are a number of points to make here:

1. Re: "When they act in such a way to avoid us as much as they can" - As far as I am concerned, black trianlges flying over the brightest lights on the planet (i.e. the belgium highways) making no attempt to hide themselves doesnt seem like avoiding us to me. Even when the belgiums sent fighters against them then didnt try and hide, they just dodged for a bit then flew off. There is a website that has mapped all the sighting of the black triangles in america and a large percentage seem to be sighted near cities or in particular highways.

2. "they are from other dimensions" - We really dont know that they are, as you can see in the black triangles poll on the site (and i know i am focusing on the triangles but they are the best documented IMO), they could be from the future, from other planets, from black US projects or from another dimension. But in truth, other dimensions are not even really scientific fact whatsoever, so that could me just about anything.

Stanton IMO contradicts himself when he says why would the aliens use something as backward as radio signals when they might be billions of years ahead of us. He bases his theory on the fact that aleins who are billions of years ahead of us wouldnt use the same technology as us.
He also theorises that they travel here using nuclear power, but this contradicts because whilst we can't quite make nuclear powered craft, we arent that far off, maybe 50 years or so. So in his theory the aliens are still using a similar technology to our own.

He says that every planet has a sun, and therefore they will always work out how it works and then use it to their own space travelling advantage. But every planet also has radio waves also so why wouldnt they still use that too? Afterall, radio waves travel near enough to the speed of light so what could be better?

My favourite theory, and i must stress its not based on any fact, just from what i have heard from scientists such a Michio Kaku is that perhaps they have found some way to step outside of our dimension yet still travel within it without being govenrned by many of its laws (i.e. light speed being max). But this is nothing more than speculation on my part.

3. Yes it does seem unlikely that we will pick up a signal, but right now, none of us really know the answers, for all we know radio waves could be used by all the civilizations in the universe. Its unlikely i know but that fact is we just don't know, and anyone who claims they do is lying.
I really do believe that whilst there may be slight government coverups in that they dont want the public to know our airspace is being invaded, i really dont believe they know what the UFO's are, or how to deal with them. Thats exactly why they cover it up, because they have no idea how to defend aginst them should they become hostile.

[Irishseekers]

Originally Posted by Hoffmeister

i'm afraid there is no 'wrong' or 'right' in anyones conclusions. There is only compelling cases, and human testimony which is not only highly unreliable in many cases as our memories of situations can change over time and also there are people who make claims because they want to 'be somebody' or do it for the book revenues.

There are a number of points to make here:

1. Re: "When they act in such a way to avoid us as much as they can" - As far as I am concerned, black trianlges flying over the brightest lights on the planet (i.e. the belgium highways) making no attempt to hide themselves doesnt seem like avoiding us to me. Even when the belgiums sent fighters against them then didnt try and hide, they just dodged for a bit then flew off. There is a website that has mapped all the sighting of the black triangles in america and a large percentage seem to be sighted near cities or in particular highways.

2. "they are from other dimensions" - We really dont know that they are, as you can see in the black triangles poll on the site (and i know i am focusing on the triangles but they are the best documented IMO), they could be from the future, from other planets, from black US projects or from another dimension. But in truth, other dimensions are not even really scientific fact whatsoever, so that could me just about anything.

Stanton IMO contradicts himself when he says why would the aliens use something as backward as radio signals when they might be billions of years ahead of us. He bases his theory on the fact that aleins who are billions of years ahead of us wouldnt use the same technology as us.
He also theorises that they travel here using nuclear power, but this contradicts because whilst we can't quite make nuclear powered craft, we arent that far off, maybe 50 years or so. So in his theory the aliens are still using a similar technology to our own.

He says that every planet has a sun, and therefore they will always work out how it works and then use it to their own space travelling advantage. But every planet also has radio waves also so why wouldnt they still use that too? Afterall, radio waves travel near enough to the speed of light so what could be better?

My favourite theory, and i must stress its not based on any fact, just from what i have heard from scientists such a Michio Kaku is that perhaps they have found some way to step outside of our dimension yet still travel within it without being govenrned by many of its laws (i.e. light speed being max). But this is nothing more than speculation on my part.

3. Yes it does seem unlikely that we will pick up a signal, but right now, none of us really know the answers, for all we know radio waves could be used by all the civilizations in the universe. Its unlikely i know but that fact is we just don't know, and anyone who claims they do is lying.
I really do believe that whilst there may be slight government coverups in that they dont want the public to know our airspace is being invaded, i really dont believe they know what the UFO's are, or how to deal with them. Thats exactly why they cover it up, because they have no idea how to defend aginst them should they become hostile.

I think you got me wrong in the first part of your post' if you need to read back my first few lines i wrote" you would understand what i meant.Yes i understand! what you mean about the triangles over Belgium in 1990s "But that is not the same as parking a large ship over a city and leaveing it there for a considerable length Of time, If they wanted to be to our so called Space brothers they would have shown themselves already to the mainstream public they have there own agenda' and we better get used to it. I believe dimensions can be explained through quantum physics i believe'" Or i could be wrong in that . Stanton freidman is probably wrong on this one to me. Nuclear through fusion will help you go long distances from our planet'" But say if these species are travelling at unbelieveable speeds and distances through the fabric of space'" I would care to guess They are probably useing some other type of method. Of course any species visiting from a different planet would be interested in our most valuable commodity or power source you could say .. (NUCLEAR ) ......is what i meant to say if anyone is wondering . how would you use radio waves for space travel" Could you explain that a little better if you dont mind your guess is as good as mine to what we would do if they became hostile, Lets hope they dont believe in weapons of destruction, which could be a Possibility since there is no real evidence out there that they have used such weapons.

[Lord Australis]

Originally Posted by Hoffmeister

A recent newspaper article i read comented on this and said that scientists are now using this data as a kind of cosmic 'Yellow pages' for SETI, so that instead of randomly scanning the sky, they can point the dishes at planets which they know have the potential for life.

Huzzah for science, but eugh... Way to take the fun out of being an astronomer.

[Hoffmeister]

Originally Posted by Irishseekers

I think you got me wrong in the first part of your post' if you need to read back my first few lines i wrote" you would understand what i meant.Yes i understand! what you mean about the triangles over Belgium in 1990s "But that is not the same as parking a large ship over a city and leaveing it there for a considerable length Of time, If they wanted to be to our so called Space brothers they would have shown themselves already to the mainstream public they have there own agenda' and we better get used to it. I believe dimensions can be explained through quantum physics i believe'" Or i could be wrong in that . Stanton freidman is probably wrong on this one to me. Nuclear through fusion will help you go long distances from our planet'" But say if these species are travelling at unbelieveable speeds and distances through the fabric of space'" I would care to guess They are probably useing some other type of method. Of course any species visiting from a different planet would be interested in our most valuable commodity or power source you could say .. (NUCLEAR ) ......is what i meant to say if anyone is wondering . how would you use radio waves for space travel" Could you explain that a little better if you dont mind your guess is as good as mine to what we would do if they became hostile, Lets hope they dont believe in weapons of destruction, which could be a Possibility since there is no real evidence out there that they have used such weapons.

Oh i meant the use of radio waves for communication, not space travel really referring to the whole SETI thing. But i really dont know what the triangles are.... one thing i do know is they are dfinastely there.