H.P. Lovecraft

[Graphimancer]

Strange thread. Lovecraft was a fantastic writer, and there is ample reason his writings are still published and will continue to still be published long after we are gone. You could easily counter that popularity does not equal quality, and you would have a valid point: Except this time, because Lovecraft indeed wrote some great, chilling tales. Clouding the issue with personal animosities or anachronistic criticisms of the man don't really change the issue.

Lovecraft has had a huge influence on popular literature.

[underdog]

"The children now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for
authority, they show disrespect to their elders.... They no longer rise
when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter
before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and
are tyrants over their teachers."

"The young people of today think of nothing but themselves. They have
no reverence for parents or old age. They are impatient of all
restraint. They talk as if they alone knew everything and what passes
for wisdom with us is foolishness with them. As for girls, they are
forward, immodest and unwomanly in speech, behaviour and dress."

-Socrates 469 - 399BC

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I think you are showing your age in your last post. Each generation brings something new to the table...don't underestimate them.

[Experiencer7]

Originally Posted by spookyparadigm

His writing can actually be quite good when he wasn't trying. His letters read well, and some of his later works have good moments of clarity (typically early in the story). But then he starts to lay it on, and it was too much.

I think his influence is a bit more profound, but I'm not ready to give him the significance Colavito does in his book, where he argues that Lovecraft invented UFOs (well specifically, that he invented ancient astronauts, but he does try to argue the UFO angle). I started reading the book, but was interrupted and need to start again. I can see some of his point, but it misses a much bigger occult and cultural tradition that Lovecraft was influenced by. It's no accident at least some early contactees, like Adamski, were involved in such things before 1947.

Glad you mentioned Jason Colavito. Here's a link to his website; http://jcolavito.tripod.com/lostcivi...ons/index.html.

[DBTrek]

Originally Posted by underdog

I think you are showing your age in your last post. Each generation brings something new to the table...don't underestimate them.

Mebbe.

Still at a 10 year low for SAT scores, though:
http://www.time.com/time/nation/arti...836111,00.html

. . . and every story I read regarding the US Educational system, the highschool drop-out rate, or core curriculum test scores of US highschool students reinforces this belief I have that we're living in a sea of ignorant monkeys.

[Experiencer7]

We all exist on different levels of ignorance.

[underdog]

SAT scores are not the whole picture. In my high school (over 25 years ago) only those in college prep or advanced placement classes took the SAT. Today every burn-out, doofus, pot head, and criminal is encouraged to take the SAT. This broad spectrum of people taking a test, originally developed for the college bound is going to give a skewed view when they are included in the scoring.

I am not trying to give cover for our often failing public school systems, but to call the next generation ignorant monkeys is the height of arrogance. I expect some arrogant, know-it-all, dumb ass said the same about your generation and mine as well. I guess, It just seemed like something Archie Bunker would say.

But more to the point...I know a good number of people of my generation (and the next...we share books at work) who have read Lovecraft, Beirce, Wells, Verne, King, Koontz, Haggard, Atwood and many many others. Our intern (20 years my junior) in the 2 months she was at the office went through Emma-Jane Austin (could carry on a good conversation and compare and contrast it with Sense and Sensibility and Pride and Predjudice), Othello-The Bard, and was in the process of starting Typee-Melville when she left.

Stupid Monkey...HARDLY! And we have boatloads of kids like this out there.

Finally, I've read a lot of Lovecraft and just because I think his victorian wordiness and utter lack of ability to write dialogue are serious problems, that doesn't make me an ignorant boob. I like Lovecraft, but his genre has been better served by contemporaries like Wells and Derlith, and modern writers like Koontz, King, and Atwood. IMHO

I'm not interested in starting a flame contest over whether or not our country is becoming filled with stupid monkeys, but I felt I needed to say something, while someone flung poo around like a monkey at the zoo.

[Brian Now]

When Lovecraft meets pop culture something abominable is bound to happen...

[Experiencer7]

Originally Posted by Brian Now

When Lovecraft meets pop culture something abominable is bound to happen...

That is too cool.

[DBTrek]

Originally Posted by underdog

I'm not interested in starting a flame contest over whether or not our country is becoming filled with stupid monkeys, but I felt I needed to say something, while someone flung poo around like a monkey at the zoo.

You have an odd way of showing it. You can be as indignant and hostile as you want, but the numbers don't lie. You're a shining defender of Generation Dumbass. You should vie for spokesman. Unfortunately you make the same mistake most dumbasses make, which is to ignore the metrics that measure the reality of the situation and instead substitute the allegory of your personal experience as divine truth. It's an easy mistake to make, lots of dumb monkeys do it.

[underdog]

Whatever you say. You must be right because you are saying it. How foolish of me to stand in the way of your newest diatribe on this forum. I am not trying to ignore the facts...just you.

Anyhow back to the thread topic. The following painting is credited to Cyril Van Der Haygen...I think it speaks volumes about the origins of Cthulhu.